The Enneagram in Business Blog | A Blog by Ginger Lapid-Bogda, Ph.D.

I think he was a nine precisely because he has cha...

2012-05-16T12:32:38.391-07:00

I think he was a nine precisely because he has characteristics of every type and confuses everyone. A nine who found his true calling would love his work so much he might resemble a 3. This quote suggests to me a nine who overcame 9 ish tendencies: " Your time is limited so don't waste it living someone else's life." and "don't let the noise of others opinions drown out your inner voice and most important have the courage to follow your heart and intuition. They somehow already know what you truly want to become. Everything else is secondary." I dont think many other numbers would even have this struggle inside enough to advise people in such a way- seems like a self actualized nine to me- but of course I'm know I'm in the minority and only he knows for sure.

Ginger, Thanks for sharing such a personal story. ...

2012-05-15T06:59:17.851-07:00

Ginger, Thanks for sharing such a personal story. For a Six, it is helpful to see how someone of another type experiences such uncertainty.

Regarding raising the consciousness of evil doers, what is more charitable than helping the undeserving? Should I condemn my friend, the priest who serves the needs of incarcerated criminals?

Ginger, your depiction of the event was just AMAZI...

2012-05-10T19:16:30.722-07:00

Ginger, your depiction of the event was just AMAZING! The first paragraph just remimded of my SAT experience.

I 'll write a private e-mail.

Regards

Gonzalo

I am guessing that those attended the program or a...

2012-05-03T13:34:55.135-07:00

I am guessing that those attended the program or around you were mostly 4s with the social type who were looking for the identities. Look at the Korean icons in myth, Tiger & Bear. I saw many people who come to your program were looking for the spiritual growth or being a spiritual teacher and these are the people who hooked on enneagram for that reasons. There are many 8s,9s,and 1s, who see things black or white and see the buildings or apartments in Seoul, there looks mostly square. There are not many authentic or beatiful buildings. sorry for the poor english but get the meaning from I wanted to say.

Thanks for sharing your inner world Ginger - I agr...

2012-05-03T09:00:05.854-07:00

Thanks for sharing your inner world Ginger - I agree with Sue, it is refreshing. Have a great time with Claudio.
Barry Ahern

(Choose the anonymous option from the drop down menu, others didn't seem to work.)

Ginger, your blogs on using all three Centers of I...

2012-04-28T08:02:39.543-07:00

Ginger, your blogs on using all three Centers of Intelligence to draw out our inspirations caused me to wonder whether part of our attention to a Center of Intelligence is attention to a particular time dimension. If so, it could help us define an aspect of what it means to pay attention to a Center. Does the following thinking make sense to you?

“Where our attention goes our behavior follows,” is one of Dr. Daniels’s reminders when helping others to understand the Enneagram patterns we see in others and ourselves. We all probably notice that some of us talk more about the past, some the now and some the future. In other words, while all of us must pay some attention to all three aspects of time to get though the day, when free, we choose among looking back, being present, and thinking ahead.

Here’s the insight that occurred to me. Thinking of the three centers: Anger for Eights, Nines, and Ones; Shame for Twos, Threes, and Fours; Fear for Fives, Sixes and Sevens, it occurs to me that each has a different primary time focus. Anger can be described as an emotion to set the past right. Shame can be described as an emotion to feel right now. Fear can be described as an emotion to make the future right.

For example, in your blog, for the Five—a Mental Center or future thinker--you recommend using the Heart Center, or said with respect to time, focus on now and in addition to the future. Good advice for the Five who often withdraws from the now. You tell them to ask, “Am I feeling something now?”

For Fours—Heart Center or now thinkers-- you recommend the Body Center, or said with respect to time, focus on the past and in addition to the now. You point out that, “Many Fours frustrate themselves by not manifesting into action that which truly inspires them.” You advise, in effect, to look to the past and ask, “What do I feel inspired to do?”

In short, should we bring the time dimension of our attention more into the foreground and use it to help us direct our attention beyond our reactivity?

This is so interesting....and also left me breathl...

2012-04-27T05:50:50.657-07:00

This is so interesting....and also left me breathless reading your thought processes, including all all the pre-planning, the level of honesty is refreshing!

Tom, I can't speak for Anonymous but since h...

2012-04-13T07:19:04.403-07:00

Tom,

I can't speak for Anonymous but since he or she referenced me I'd like to comment. You and I are pretty much on the same wavelength, I think. "Science" is of course a generic term and when we use it in relationship to the Enneagram (or any soft or social science) we need to be clear about what we are discussing. Hard sciences such as chemistry and physics allow for much more certainty; soft sciences such as anthropology and psychology require much less. I believe that the Enneagram falls into the latter category, of course. As I was very clear in stating in the post that Anonymous referred to, I hold my assessment of Jobs's Ennea-type provisionally, and think that we should hold all such assessments provisionally. While I'm always leery of analogies that invoke quantum physics (QP doesn't apply at the macro level), I believe we can only make best estimates of someone's type based on the evidence available.

My disagreements with Peter's blog are two-fold: His assessment of Fours as being somehow incapable of being leaders of large organizations does not seem consistent with my observations of Fours (I have been an executive coach for nearly 15 years now), and his creation of a new category of Ennea-type (binary types) seems both inaccurate and unnecessary. You're correct, Peter does violate Occam, who urged not that we embrace the simplest explanation, but that we not add factors unnecessarily. That is, if we can explain something using (x) steps, we should not do so in (x+1) steps. I think Peter violates this advice, not by proposing that there are exceptions to the consensus understanding of the Enneagram but by doing so without the necessary rigor to justify the invocation of (+1).

And this is the heart of my article to which Anonymous referred: While no model of personality is (and I doubt ever will be) a science with the same degree of certainty of physics, the community as a whole needs to do a better job of at least defining its terms and being more rigorous in the assessment of data. This is not to say that everyone needs to use the same terminology, but individuals must be internally consistent in their criteria for what constitutes a particular type rather than rely on an intuitive interpretation of a general gestalt of what makes one a Four or a Seven or an Eight. Clearly defining criteria allows one to follow a consistent methodology, which will increase the credibility and validity of conclusions.

Yes, not everyone needs to have the same view of the Ennea-type of a public figure, especially one unknown to the viewer beyond the subject's public persona. The Enneagram, as a social science, is not an exact science. We can't simply check the math and see why someone came to the wrong conclusion. However, it does not have the inherent complexity of weather or plate tectonics, and even ethnographic studies establish some methodologies and rigor.

My hope for the Enneagram community is not that the Enneagram become a hard science or that the community agree on a standard model or who is what type, but that we start embracing a more rigorous mindset--yes, a more "scientific" mindset. Rigor, even at an individual level, benefits the person doing the analysis, any client the person may be working with, and anyone who may be reading the musings of a theorist. It has the added advantage of increasing accuracy of prediction, meaning that people rigorously assessing the topic will come to similar conclusions more frequently. Though it is not my top concern, such an outcome would help satisfy the needs of Anonymous and many others who view the Enneagram skeptically and thus miss out on its benefits.

Dear Anonymous, Your reckoning is just fine, I thi...

2012-04-11T08:12:00.652-07:00

Dear Anonymous,
Your reckoning is just fine, I think. When writing these blogs, I decided to use a different Center for each type in the Center of the blog's focus. So for the Head Center, I chose the Body Center for Sixes (because that is where I think 6s can get the most support; their minds and hearts often work in tandem, but the Body is where they get the most relief if they center themselves). As a result, I then picked the Head Center for Sevens, even though this might appear to be counter-intuitive. My reasoning is that they can really use their mind to focus their mind (they can also use their bodies). The heart is what lies beneath all this (that's where I think you are clearly right)but they often need to use their bodies to access this. So 7s need to still the body and focus the mind, then the heart comes along more easily. But I will describe this all in the blog. Really, I could have picked any center for any of the types, so I took editorial choices!

I am just curious about the part 3 whether alignin...

2012-04-11T01:37:53.548-07:00

I am just curious about the part 3 whether aligning of centers is right. My reckon is Five- body, six- mind and seven - heart. I may be wrong????

I wonder why Anonymous believes we should not trea...

2012-04-06T11:37:53.511-07:00

I wonder why Anonymous believes we should not treat the Enneagram as a science. A quick google search gives a definition of science as "The intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world." Other areas of inquiry, for example, social sciences and, even, biology use a similar method of study called Ethnography. In Ethnographic studies data are collected through participant observations, interviews, questionaires, etc.

While lack of consensus or other uncertainty may be frustrating, it is a normal part of scientific inquiry. Think of the poor quantum physicists trying to figure out where that darn electron is and how fast it is moving. They are reduced to statistical analysis, never to be absolutely sure. (Which reminds one of the joke asking why quantum physicists are so poor at sex? Because when they find the position, they can't find the momentum, and when they have the momentum, they can't find the position.) Or, pity the poor scientist trying to save lives by predicting California's next earthquake. Or--back to sex--how frustrating must it be for marine scientists not to know the breeding habits of the Whale Shark!

I certainly agree that increasing rigor in the method of Enneagram studies is valuable. Those using the ethnographic method are always challenged to be disciplined. But dealing with uncertainty does not mean one is not dealing in science.

Very interesting and useful.

2012-04-06T09:12:24.159-07:00

Very interesting and useful.

We’re not completely sure why this is happening. I...

2012-04-05T13:09:36.640-07:00

We’re not completely sure why this is happening. It could be this photo and text layout. Or it might be a browser issue. The text is fine with some browsers and not with others. Would you please check out our St. Patrick’s Day post, which has a similar layout, and let us know if you have problems with text there as well? Thanks for letting us know!

The fact that there is so little consensus among E...

2012-04-02T06:35:03.913-07:00

The fact that there is so little consensus among Enneagram experts on Jobs and other celebrity Enneagram types suggests to me that there is a lack of consensus with respect to type definitions and typing methodology.

One does not see this sort of disagreements using such scientifically based typing systems as the Five Factor Model.

I suspect that the Enneagram community would benefit from a more rigorous approach to underlying definitions and methodology. I believe this can be done without trying to turn the Enneagram into "science"--which it is not and never should be. Mario Sikora's recent article on typing methodology is a step in that direction. More consensus among experts means more credibility for the Enneagram.

http://enneagramlearning.blogspot.com/2012/04/on-typing-steve-jobs-heuristics-and.html

Wow! What a well-thought-out, impressively fact-b...

2012-03-27T17:47:12.516-07:00

Wow! What a well-thought-out, impressively fact-based analysis. I also like Peter Zappel’s open-minded approach to the Enneagram in positing the binary type. Nonetheless, I think there is reason to question the need for a new concept to explain the wide range of Jobs’s behavior.
I like the idea of thinking of the Enneagram as an ever evolving tool to help us understand human behavior. So, new concepts, such as the binary type, should be welcomed for consideration. To treat the Enneagram as static dogma would be a mistake. Using a Buddhist concept, it would be like thinking that the Big Dipper we see is the sky is really a big dipper. Of course, like the Enneagram, it is merely a useful and interesting pattern.
I wonder why does all of Jobs’s, or anyone’s, behavior need to be explained by the Enneagram? We have many other useful concepts. Would it not be adequate to explain that Jobs was a Seven with One and Five Lines, a strong Eight Wing and a palpable Six Wing? His Fourish behavior is easily explained by non-Enneagram concepts such as learning, context or rewards. In other words, Jobs the Seven could have learned that life often called for expressing himself (like a Four) and he wisely responded. The context within which he worked may have made self expression more welcomed. He WAS the idolized inventor. Or, early in life, someone important to him may have lavishly rewarded him for self-expressive behavior.
Occam’s razor comes to mind, the law of parsimony, the economy of succinctness. It urges the thoughtful to select the simplest explanation. We do not want to become Enneagram fundamentalists, treating the Enneagram as received truth within which all must be explained, forcing the development of more and more elaborate doctrines. It is okay if the Enneagram falls short of completely explaining someone’s behavior.
The above notwithstanding, kudos to Peter Zappel for inventiveness and, perhaps, starting a very important debate which just might prove me and Occam to be wrong.

Same problem here. Two Love is missing.

2012-03-27T12:31:13.536-07:00

Same problem here. Two Love is missing.

Funnily enough, I have over the years associated t...

2012-03-23T01:41:13.645-07:00

Funnily enough, I have over the years associated the zebra with the 6, picking up on the herd instinct and its persistent watchfulness for danger. I note the Cape Buffalo association with six in this typology. I guess different features of animal species appeal to different types. These variations don't lessen the value of reflecting on the nuances of description of each style, however, and I appreciate the insights explored in this series.

Love,love,love the way you establish the parallels...

2012-03-22T16:09:22.323-07:00

Love,love,love the way you establish the parallels between number sevens and antelopes :-)

I couldn't convince you to write a short blog ...

2012-03-20T17:03:40.238-07:00

I couldn't convince you to write a short blog on Jobs as a 3, could I? I'm sort of kidding as I know how busy you are, but still...

Barry Ahern is to be congratulated on a fine analy...

2012-03-18T06:20:32.825-07:00

Barry Ahern is to be congratulated on a fine analysis. This is the way typing of public figures should be done: humbly, provisionally (dependent on future discoveries and with a willingness to change one's mind), and based on a careful analysis. It is clear that he did not start with an assumption and then set out to prove it by cherry-picking anecdotes and factoids. It is often said that it is not so much whether your conclusions are correct (though I am in agreement with Barry in seeing Jobs as a Sexual Four), it is the methods by which you come to your conclusions that really count. In the long run this dictum will make one more accurate more often. I hope all of us in the Enneagram community will follow Barry's approach.

Mario's analysis strikes me as the most carefu...

2012-03-18T06:08:48.159-07:00

Mario's analysis strikes me as the most carefully reasoned. His approach to the makes all the difference.

It has occurred to me that Steve Jobs is most like...

2012-03-14T06:39:44.104-07:00

It has occurred to me that Steve Jobs is most like a Three with a Four wing. I could make a casecfor this, but time does not permit it.... Just something for you and others to consider...

A thoughtful and enlightening analysis.thank you f...

2012-03-10T04:06:04.140-08:00

A thoughtful and enlightening analysis.thank you for sharing!

You made some good points .I did a little research...

2012-03-06T02:32:22.577-08:00

You made some good points .I did a little research on the topic and found that most people agree with your blog. Thanks.

Best Regards,
Free Nifty tips

LOVE your blog, thanks, greatly inspiring. Two, t...

2012-03-01T07:09:26.447-08:00

LOVE your blog, thanks, greatly inspiring. Two, three and four LOVE above are jumbled with a missing quote, would love it all to be there!