Comments on The Enneagram in Business Blog | A Blog by Ginger Lapid-Bogda, Ph.D.: The Crash and Burn of John Edwards: Enneagram Styl...

I enjoyed reading this, Ginger, as I have your oth...

2010-12-15T19:25:42.102-08:00

I enjoyed reading this, Ginger, as I have your other blog entries. Thank you for writing. I have some questions brought about by one of your comments.

How do you define the difference between the Seven's Narcissism (with a capital n) and the Three's narcissism (with a small n)? I have noticed that some Enneagram teachers believe the Three is more apt Seven to experience true clinical Narcisism, whereas the Seven displays narcissistic traits without being a "true narcissist"...and other teachers believe just the opposite. Do Sevens find it more difficult than Threes to be empathetic, to truly feel another's pain? Which (the 7 or the 3) actually believes most in their own worth?

Thank you!

Thanks, Amiel. To know if the stress of his wife&...

2010-02-12T14:13:27.821-08:00

Thanks, Amiel.

To know if the stress of his wife's cancer was a factor, we'd need to do a timeline about when he learned she had cancer and when he began his affair. If it was before learning about the cancer, well ... If it's after, well.. it's a highly dysfunctional and painful way to deal with big life challenge. But, even so, it would give him an excuse for his behavior which is questionable if one values personal responsibility. I think there can be a fine line between an excuse and an explanation, and sometimes an explanation is a rationalization.

In some countries outside the US, some wonder why we in the US make such a big deal about infidelity, which is as common as it is not. This is a good question in many ways, but I think the issue is more about the lying and cover up as what he did. That she has cancer makes what he did and the cover up more of an issue.

Normally, my blogs (and writing in general)are written more neutrally or less stridently, and often that's exactly what I think and feel. In this case, I just wanted to write it this way (and enjoyed every minute of the writing).

I will check into the book you recommend!

Ginger, Wonderful analysis. A few additional thoug...

2010-02-11T21:26:15.133-08:00

Ginger,
Wonderful analysis. A few additional thoughts:

1. John Edwards also projected the image of someone who is fallible and honest about his fallibility. Exhibit A: "I was wrong to vote for the Iraq war." He must have said the words "I was wrong" two hundred times during the 2008 primaries. Exhibit B: His confession of adultery and apology, which we later learned was itself a deceit.

2. Back in 1998, I had lunch with one of the earliest volunteers on his U.S. Senate race. I remember very clearly the two words she used to describe him: "idealistic" and "genuine." My sense from that and other articles written about him is that, as you write, for many years he was at a medium level of self-mastery

3. What caused the decline? I don't know either, but can we add "stress of one's wife have a terminal diagnosis" to the list?

4. One other deceit to add to your list: "We're in this race until the convention." He said this in speeches after losing his third straight primary in 2008, and I received numerous emails from his campaign saying this and asking for money. Hardened politicos know this is a common deceit, used for leverage, but it was still a deceit.

Thanks again, Ginger. By the way, have you read Richard Ben Cramer's book on the 1988 election, What It Takes? Incredibly insightful imagining of the inner worlds of Biden, Dole, Bush 41, Dukakis, Gephardt and more.

Amiel

To "Gontxu," Thankfully, you've not ...

2010-02-11T15:13:47.893-08:00

To "Gontxu,"
Thankfully, you've not experienced low-self mastery for Threes!Of course, low self-mastery for any type is not a pretty sight!

After reading a lot of biographies of Bill Clinton (and talking to some friends who have know him for years), I think he may be a 7, not a 3 (as I used to think). Apparently, he is and has always been really, really unfocused, which is a cause of major conflict between Bill and Hillary. This fits far better with 7 than 3 (who are often said to be overly focused).

I also read something very funny in these biographies: "Bill and Hillary have 1 thing in common; Hillary loves Bill and Bill loves Bill." This could be 3 or 7, but seems more aptly to describe the Narcissism of most 7s (capital N on narcissism) than the narcissism of some 3s (little n on narcissim).

I totally agree with you on Monica and Hillary on their type though I think Hillary might be a social subtype 1 ("the perfect example") and Monica may be a 1-1 subtype 2 (aka sexual subtype). But these a guesses on my part.

Though I´m not familiar with John Edwards´ case (I...

2010-02-11T08:34:49.983-08:00

Though I´m not familiar with John Edwards´ case (I´m from Argentina), I found the whole article quite interesting and somehow, it reminded me of the Clinton/Lewinsky affaire (If I´m not mistaken, Clinton´s a SX 3; Monica a SO 2 and Hillary a SX 1).
I´m a Three as well, but I never experienced the ¨Low-Self¨ Mastery. Í bounce between high and moderate, but I´m in self-developemt since many years now.

Ginger, what a great analysis. I wonder if any of ...

2010-02-08T17:36:36.132-08:00

Ginger, what a great analysis. I wonder if any of the three characters in this tragedy would be able to see themselves clearly enough to acknowlege their respective roles. Thanks. Marianne Kaplan